[MidoNet] [MidoNet-user] [MidoNet-dev] Slack vs IRC

Adam Johnson adam at midokura.com
Tue Aug 4 16:39:08 UTC 2015


Hi,

I feel like moving to IRC is backwards.. Several communities are moving to
Slack because it offers a better user experience out of the box, including
backtrace history for all users, easy channel discovery, easy signup, etc.
It already has bots like hubot ported to it, meetbot or an alternative
should be easy to find.

When we were on IRC previously, we had an issue of many of our contributors
not participating. When we moved to Slack, we saw a dramatic uptake in
activity.  I am afraid that moving back to IRC will lower community
adoption.

Many of the existing MidoNet devs and users are already using Slack for
their work, and we've heard no major complaints.

Also note that if we move off of Slack, we need to change
metrics.midonet.org back to tracking IRC, which may require a budget or
some developer to donate their time.

Adam

On Wed, Jul 29, 2015 at 10:07 AM, Sandro Mathys <sandro at midokura.com> wrote:

> On Thu, Jul 30, 2015 at 12:54 AM, Jaume Devesa <devvesa at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Hello all,
>
> Thanks Jaume, for posting this to the dev list - I'm also
> cross-posting it to the general and user lists for wider visibility -
> it's quite obvious that the dev list will agree with this but maybe
> less so others :)
>
> I'll add my opinion below.
>
> > it has been raised many times that Slack may not be the most suitable
> tool
> > to
> > build a community of developers around MidoNet. Personally, I think
> Slack is
> > a great
> > enterprise messaging tool, but software development has been built too
> much
> > around
> > IRC and provides a more developer-focused messaging features.
> >
> > I did a request to discuss it on the previous Community Council Meeting
> that
> > happened yesterday. Logs here[1]
> >
> > 90% of the people agreed to move to IRC during that meeting. Points for
> IRC:
>
> Hm, I counted much closer to 100% - I think everyone was in favor, but
> we also found one or two (as we saw it, negligible) reasons against
> the idea - mostly the users who are not familiar with IRC or don't
> want to use it, but you already included why we don't see this as an
> issue below.
>
> >  * All opensource developers have a client of IRC running on their
> machines.
> > Slack
> >    does not even have a linux client.
> >  * Easier to get collaboration with developers who use IRC from close
> > communities
> >    like #openstack-neutron, #fuel, #juju-charms or #docker
>
> #rdo #centos/-devel, #puppet/-devel, #ansible, #opnfv-meeting,
> #opencontainers, ...
>
> I'd like to emphasize this point. Really pretty much any project we're
> interacting with, and more importantly: pretty much any project we'd
> like to interact with us, is using Freenode IRC. Obviously, it's much
> easier to ask them to join yet another IRC channel than to ask them to
> join us on Slack.
>
> And while integration with OpenStack has always been important and the
> people working on that already had to use both Slack and IRC, with the
> progress we're making (and additional efforts we're planning) to
> integrate with installers and the work on deployment tools, pretty
> much everyone on the development team(s) has to use both by now, if
> they want to communicate efficiently. But keeping an eye on both is
> challenging and distracting - it's easy to miss an important
> conversation on either of both.
>
> >  * `Meetbot` for log the meetings is a widely used tool.
> >  * People who are not used to run IRC can use http://kiwiirc.com
> >  * Mailing lists and Askbot encouraged for asynchronous communication and
> > people
> >    who don't want to use IRC
>
> Mailing lists or Ask MidoNet are great for these users. But frankly, I
> think most users (which, in our case are mostly operators of OpenStack
> or maybe Docker clouds) are already on IRC to communicate with all the
> other projects whose software they're leveraging, too.
>
> > At the same time, it seems Slack is getting traction
> >  * https://dist-sys-slack.herokuapp.com/
> >
> > We would like to discuss it more before do any movement, so people who
> > didn't
> > attend to the community meeting:
> >
> >  1. Please attend to community meetings :)
>
> Pretty please with a cherry on top :)
>
> >  2. Express your opinion if you care the discussion.
>
> Let's hear them! :) Obviously, I'm in favor of moving (back) to IRC :)
>
> Cheers,
> Sandro
>
> > Best,
> >
> > [1]:
> > https://github.com/midonet/midonet/wiki/Community-Council-Log-2015.07.28
> >
> > --
> > Jaume Devesa
> > Software Engineer at Midokura
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > MidoNet-dev mailing list
> > MidoNet-dev at lists.midonet.org
> > http://lists.midonet.org/listinfo/midonet-dev
> >
> _______________________________________________
> MidoNet-user mailing list
> MidoNet-user at lists.midonet.org
> http://lists.midonet.org/listinfo/midonet-user
>
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